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Post by wilmar10 on May 20, 2021 1:45:34 GMT
How would the fighters of Universe 9 have done in the tournament if they all had the Ultimate form before the tournament started?
I think Yamcha still would have forfeited against Android 18, but I’m not sure how the fight between Videl and King Cold/Captain Ginyu would go, how the fight between Tien and Universe 4 Buu would go, and how the fight between Krillin and Tapion & Hirudegarn would go.
How do you guys think things would go?
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Post by Blaze on May 21, 2021 10:53:18 GMT
Videl would probably beat Ginyu unless he transformed into his final/6th form. In that case, I'm not sure. She might still be stronger than him. Her maximum kaioken was able to beat a Cell Jr, so yeah. If she beats Ginyu, she can easily beat Bardock but would likely fall against Bra.
Tenshinhan has no hope against Buu no matter what. But I think Krillin would be able beat Tapion, he nearly did so in the original fight. Cell would then stomp him.
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Post by Dismaned on May 22, 2021 14:17:15 GMT
Kaio Ken becomes an outdated technique.
The future is now old man
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Post by Happi on May 22, 2021 18:09:15 GMT
So if this happened just before the tournament began? Ho boy, that's a lot of pages you gotta dissect but this is a challenge I'll accept.
So starting off the bat, Yamcha v 18 ends off the same note-- although I'm partially skeptical if an cyborg could really grow stronger, wheather it's training or magic. Although to close this off, if he really could get his potential unlocked, he would certainly be some where around the level of P.Cell (at full power, without the zenkai) if he's exactly as powerful as the cyborgs we know. Sadly we don't know much about his strength nor if his potential would be quicker or longer to unlock.
Videl before and after fighting King Kold's third(?) reduction form has shown promising feats. First off, she can wield the freaking Z sword that a weaker Gohan had to force out-- only managing to carry it normally with extensive training: so she must be around SSJ2, right?
Weeeeeeell... yes and no, you see it is very impressive to hold it so casually but South pointed out that she's weaker than a kaioshin (who are somewhat between SSJ Goke and SSJ Teen Gohan from the Cell games, as their needed to be a minimum of 3 to hold down Kold (6th form) that's stated to be near Perfect Cell's level) and clearly she couldn't take down the weakest majin Cell Jr (btw that's the one Cell brought to the tournament at the start-- his next offspring was essentially himself at the start of the Cell games when he played with Goku) who I believe is at least SSJ Teen Gohan.
So... it's a bit difficult to pinpoint her current strength. I say approximately around Cell games Piccolo as she needed to use a maximum kaioken to defeat basically a grade 4 SSJ Jr. So what about her potential? Videl EASILY peaks at the level of M a SSJ2 Vegeta from the buy saga do to her potential being precisely twice as long than the average time it would take. Due to adult Gohan who was low-SSJ2 tier after training with the sword got around the high tier of SSJ3 (after a 'few' extra hours) that SPC zenkai'd up to today in the tournament, so Videl is rightfully given a massive boost but placed not incredibly too high... but not amazing either. Videl loses to SSJ Bra in the end but she'll certainly not have to endanger her well-being to kick the Cell jr this time around.
Tien v Buu... Tien ultimately loses as his strength feats aren't really... spectacular. Don't get me wrong, do to him not being decimated by the Cell Jr in one hit is impressive. He's just on the spectrum of power as SSJ F.Trunks (Cell Games). I say his potential unlocked is around SSJ2 Vegeta (Buu Saga) if we're going by the minimum of old Kai's 5 hours of prep time. Would undoubtedly not matter in the tournament powerful for any of his techniques to do considerable damage-- except for the mafuba wave that is an auto-win if done quickly. Definitely does a lot better against the majin Cell Jr though.
Old Krillin v Tapion. If I took age out as an factor and gave him a boost, he could realistically win. Perfect Cell would be hellish to beat as he's mid-tier SSJ3 at this point, although it's not out of the question that Krillin can show off a highly advance destruco disc technique buuuut that's unknown by the time of this is posted. He surely won't win the tournament but he'll be the embodyment of how special U9 really is in our eyes.
Overall the best ones out of this is Videl and Krillin.
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Post by Happi on Jun 4, 2021 20:15:15 GMT
Actually I'm going to take back what I said because I forgot one very important thing: Android/Cyborg 16 is really, really weak when comparing to a FPSSJ. Therefore Tien would have been torn through like paper even if he blocked...
So what I'm going to do is give some background prior to the U9 vs Majin Cell Jr scene. I'll give speculations how powerful the Earthlings are and what their would-be boost if Elder Kai unlocked it, however, everyone (except for Videl) will be given the same buff treatment that Gohan received. I must apologize before I start this; I'm not able to attach images on the website for whatever reason (although I'm sorta noobish how stuff works here, idk how to even bold/italicized text lol) so please bare with what I say. Okay let's do this. ----------------------------------------- Background on the Cell Junior (orignal universe to DBM): As we all know, the first spawn(s) of Cell we have seen are capable of fighting toe to toe with someone like Super Vegeta from the Cell Games arc (who we know is stronger than Semi-Perfect Cell, who is infamously known to be stronger than A16). However, Super Vegeta still somewhat struggled in his fight but held his own quite well. Goku (Cell games) is much stronger than Vegeta at this point with some tidbits of dialogue, while Gohan exceeds his father (although not by much at base form) which Cell himself points out.
Got all that? Great! Now immediately throw this information away because the Cell Jr of U17 (that Cell orignally brought to the tournament) isn't from the batch that fought the Z-fighters, because all of them are DEAD. Aaaagh. :')
I'll point you to the only U17 Special as of now (which I overlooked and made me want to redo this) and you can see that Cell made new Cell Jrs at the very end of the chapter (pg 352 & 353). Now why are these different and why I'm agonizing over? These are spawns of SUPER Perfect Cell, not Perfect Cell, big big diffrence. Such a big diffrence in fact, the bug man was confident enough he can beat Gohan and in U17... he won obviously.
Now we got a SPC Cell Jr now. I'm going to just say this junior's level is between SSJ Teen Gohan and FPSSJ Goku, just to keep it simple, this means a lower-tier SSJ2 won't be swatting 7 of these so easily. So as my orignal post still stands that this bugger is a FPSSJ but this is without the majin boost... Ahaha this is great.:>
The majin boost is really finicky, no one really knows a definite answer if it's a set score or unlocks a (minor) amount of potential (minor as in worst/even with Guuru's) for the victim. So I'm going to state that this junior is either a teeny tiny bit stronger or on par with SSJ Gohan. End. ----------------------------------------- Background on U9 Humans: If you don't know the story about them, in summary, they took a stance against essentially every threat in the orignal universe (U18) had but with many changes.
Videl (& kaioshin): Videl we all know fought exceptionally well against 3rd form Kold (who we know from the recent Mirai special that he's stronger than post-Namek SSJ Goku) but she had to use a kaioken to keep up. So she's already on the low spectrum of SSJ tier with that alone. Not shabby. :T However to complicate things, South Kai points out despite wielding the Z sword that she's (in theory till North Kai says his speech bubble, which is also a theory) weaker than a kaioshin. Easy. We just need to determine how strong a kaioshin is.
In chapter 25 (Deus Ex Machina) pg 554 we see that South Kai is capable of eliminating the entire Bojack gang himself. Why do I say himself? Well the kais stick to their own quadrants of the universe as it's their responsibility, the only time they work together is when it's serious. So from this we know that South is at the very minimum to be Perfect Cell/SSJ2 Gohan tear. We also know that he's the strongest of all the kaioshin from the manga, so we also know that he isn't referring to himself when he says "weaker than a kaioshin".
Just to cut it short and sweet from my previous post, kaioshin are pretty weak when paired up against Perfect Cell foes. As we can look at the infamous majin rebellion arc to give praise once more as we take a look how West, East and North faired against Dabura. Page 1363. Wow... pathetic. Let's just say they're one of the super saiyans in the Cell games for a tier because we know Dabura is above that but below SSJ2 Gohan. We'll ignore the fight between Kold and the kaioshins because clearly their is a technique that can hold much stronger people (1399+1400), so yeah.
So from I had stated, Videl is above Post-Namek SSJ Goku (while in kaioken) clearly without much of an arguement but still below 3rd form Kold. So this disproves my orignal statement of her being at the level of Piccolo (Cell Games). Although this does mean that the human's are capable of an INSANELY powerful kaioken that can kill someone many times stronger, such as the Cell Jr. Which makes U9 even cooler!
Phew... all that typing for one character.
Tien (& Yamcha): As I stated at the very start, an Cell Jr would destroy A16. So let's not make the same mistake about the SPC Majin Cell Jr... I put him around Super Vegeta (wow how ironic) because the gap between him and SSJ Teen Gohan isn't big enough to be one shotted. I put Yamcha in this tier as well (although weaker: like Super F.Trunks (w/o ASSJ)) because I can legit see two Super Vegeta's capable of making a SSJ Gohan their @$%&!
Krillin: Not much to say for his feats other than he's not much of a challenge for the majin Cell Jr (without kaioken). As I personally believe he's the main character of the universe, I reckon he's SSJ Goku from the Cell Games as well.
Wow. All of these guys (except Videl) are really strong, much stronger than the cyborgs lmao. ----------------------------------------- Unlocked Potential & Tournament: Yamcha: SSJ2 Goku/Vegeta. Honestly we can say that his match with 18 will end the same but let's theorize for fun. He advances in the rounds against 18 and Arale. XXI could possibly beat Yamcha... although probably by other means, as we don't actually know if Yamcha can be affected by the remote (imo probably not, Bulma may have removed it so Dr.Gero couldn't deactivate him) but even if he did advance, he is curbstomped by (U4) Buu.
Tien: Fat Buu. He COULD actually destroy Zen Buu if the bubble gum doesn't raise his defenses but that's just me. If he advances, he can surely beat adult Gotenks with the mafuba if quick enough or evade till the fusion wears off. He loses to XXI.
Tien vs Yamcha: If these two by all chances beat their respective brackets, Tien would win afaik (as far as I know). Tien would lose to Bra/Gast though.
Videl: Kid Buu. She beats Kold and Barddock but can play with SSJ Bra... I argue Videl could win because she has better technique but Bra can easily go SSJ2 to obliterate her (although she may not because she can't control it?), either way Gast is too OP with magic.
Tien vs Videl: By the off chance this match is even plausible, I argue Tien because he's the only one out of the two to show techniques (even in the novel Videl didn't use any cool techniques than just melee iirc) and he must know how Videl fights at this point. Not sure who would win in the left bracket but I think the only shot of winning Tien has is against Uub.
Old Master Krillin: SSJ3 Goku. DESTROYS TAPION. Next match would be Cell/Vegeta, who I doubt he can beat but if he does... Uub/Goku would be a harder as they seen all his tricks during that match.
O.M Krillin vs Tien: By the infinite universes if EVERY 'if' in the unsure fights went U9's way, Krillin would be the champion. The two have known each other for years, so any tricks up their sleeves are off the table. Krillin is simply just too strong. ----------------------------------------- That's a wrap! Hope this is a great explanation of how the U9 Earthlings would perform if their potential was unlocked.
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