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Post by Dr. Wheelo on Aug 24, 2016 2:48:54 GMT
I got this idea from Axalon's thread, but wanted to make it more general instead of limited to GT.
What universe would you add? What fighters/universe would you remove to make them fit? How would you work them into the brackets?
For me, I would go for something like this.
U15: Android Universe (Dr. Gero, 19, 15, 14, 13)
-This is the one big main-series villain that's noticeably missing, as such it would be top priority when including a new universe, there's even an obvious link to tie in three movie villains powerful enough to give good fights in the tournament. While he may not make it too far his scientific and cunning mind would give him a lot of potential for making moves behind the scenes. It would be interesting to see some of his interactions would have been to things like #16, #17, #18, and of course his greatest creation; Cell from U17. I can't help but feel the roster just isn't quite complete without him, as for how it could work in the brackets. Gero and 19 would be substantially stronger than the U18 versions because they have absorbed the ki of every powerful fighter they have come across, while the movie androids would potentially be stronger as well since Gero would have had time to update them for all of those years.
Beezlebub for #19- Quite frankly, Beezlebub is too weak to really belong in the tournament anyways, I've read his short manga and there's nothing that even puts him past canon King Piccolo. An Android 19 who has gotten substantially stronger from absorbing the ki of powerful fighters from across his verse would have made a much more interesting fight and better served to show that King Piccolo is actually a powerful threat for defeating him.
I'K'L for #15- The pimp vs the gangster, the fight that truly kicks off the tournament. With 17 having grown weaker and Gero being able to do constant updates on 15 they turn out to be near equals and have a brutal and intense match. 17 either barely edges out and destroys him, or 15 wins and gets his head punched off by Goku next round.
Sun Wukong for #14- I feel this would have been a much more intense fight than the one we got, instead of the monkey king getting humiliated by Tien who seemingly didn't even try, this one would push Tien to his limits before Buu came around and made him look obsolete next round. He'd be going max Kaioken just to survive, he'd be fighting a losing battle, but would ultimately tag 14 with a Kikoho that would destroy him.
Mary Sue/Arale for #13- First round he takes out Mary Sue because Androids can't feel lust, or it's a repeat of Arale vs 18 where she pounds on 13 but gets written out of the tourney, or just have him fight someone else. Next round he'd fight 18 (she'd have to already have gotten repaired to make it interesting though), maybe she gets a slight upper hand until he reveals the parts from 14 and 15 destroyed in round one, transforms and pounds her into submission. Next round Super 13 falls to the XXI remote trick just like #18.
U10 Bardock for Dr. Gero- He's the hardest to place on the bracket, create an interesting fight with, and still make work. I was thinking maybe something like him taking out Pan in Kakarot's place first round, but that would make two dramatic Pan fights in a row and Pan vs Kakarot was pretty plot important, it would take a lot of reworking to make this happen. Round 2 he'd be facing a much different "Goku" than the one we're used to, it would be a closer fight than Pan vs Kakarot but he would ultimately get torn down by the barbarian but would still be important overall with behind the scenes play like Frieza and Babadi. |
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Post by Ashanark on Aug 24, 2016 3:33:16 GMT
Come to think of it, it really is startling that Dr. Gero hasn't shown up in DBM in any way--not even a reference. Gero was so creepily evil that I think it was a bad idea for Toriyama to kill him off so early. Both he and Imperfect Cell should've stuck around a lot longer...
Since basically all of U2 and U10 were filler characters except for maybe Nekomajin and Nail, and because the U6 girls were pointless, too, I think any of them could be swapped out with someone else without any problems.
The only one I can think of at this moment is a "serious Gohan" universe. (Because I'm a Gohan fanboy.) This could either be what Future Gohan would've been like had he never lost his arm and gotten killed by the androids, or else what Gohan would've become if Goku had been revived after Cell and made sure Gohan never stopped training. Gohan's power has gotten talked up a lot in DBM but he hasn't actually done much yet, so seeing a Gohan fighting at Mystic level without the Mystic upgrade would be cool. I think he'd be able to have meaningful conversations with Future Trunks, Gohan, Goku (he'd be so pleased that his son actually decided to train) and Vegeta. Giving him a fight against Goku or Vegeta would be very satisfying, but if he had to take the spot of somebody else, maybe he could swap out for Xeniloum's place and go up against U4 Buu in the first round. He'd lose, but it'd be against a respectable opponent. Or maybe he could go up against Pan and forfeit because she's his daughter in another universe.
And even if it's just a minicomic or something, I really really want to see a scene where the announcers say "The next match is between Vegito of Universe 22 and [insert name here]" and it's Candy Vegito who enters the ring. We all know he would be unstoppable.
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Post by Symbiotic on Aug 24, 2016 11:45:11 GMT
Come to think of it, it really is startling that Dr. Gero hasn't shown up in DBM in any way--not even a reference. Gero was so creepily evil that I think it was a bad idea for Toriyama to kill him off so early. Both he and Imperfect Cell should've stuck around a lot longer...
Since basically all of U2 and U10 were filler characters except for maybe Nekomajin and Nail, and because the U6 girls were pointless, too, I think any of them could be swapped out with someone else without any problems.
The only one I can think of at this moment is a "serious Gohan" universe. (Because I'm a Gohan fanboy.) This could either be what Future Gohan would've been like had he never lost his arm and gotten killed by the androids, or else what Gohan would've become if Goku had been revived after Cell and made sure Gohan never stopped training. Gohan's power has gotten talked up a lot in DBM but he hasn't actually done much yet, so seeing a Gohan fighting at Mystic level without the Mystic upgrade would be cool. I think he'd be able to have meaningful conversations with Future Trunks, Gohan, Goku (he'd be so pleased that his son actually decided to train) and Vegeta. Giving him a fight against Goku or Vegeta would be very satisfying, but if he had to take the spot of somebody else, maybe he could swap out for Xeniloum's place and go up against U4 Buu in the first round. He'd lose, but it'd be against a respectable opponent. Or maybe he could go up against Pan and forfeit because she's his daughter in another universe.
And even if it's just a minicomic or something, I really really want to see a scene where the announcers say "The next match is between Vegito of Universe 22 and [insert name here]" and it's Candy Vegito who enters the ring. We all know he would be unstoppable. Agreed, but why not go full negative as well? There are tons of fanworks out there where Gohan gets kidnapped by Raditz and becomes a cold warrior, why not have him be the ideal Gohan just for contrasts sake? He may not be as strong as your pure Z-Fighter Gohan, but it would be cool to see. I have a folder of universe ideas actually (for a decaying fan project) that I'll get to when I'm back home later. Or just plundering DBMA could be good  |
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Post by Android 13 on Aug 24, 2016 11:53:43 GMT
I would personally add every single Movie villain for spice, and to expand the story  (except, you know, that Bio-Slime): Movie 1 - Immortal Garlic Jr. and his saga's henchmen (I think they were Mustard, Vinegar and Salt, and were called the Spice Boys, but I could be wrong). Movie 2 - Dr. Wheelo, Dr.Kochin and his Bio-Men Movie 3 - Turles and his Crusher Corps Movie 4 - Lord Slug with his youth restored, and his gang Movie 5 - we already have Cooler, so no need for 2 Coolers (unless you want a universe where Cooler killed Goku after Frieza and King Cold died) Movie 6 - now, Meta Cooler could join I guess, he has slightly different techniques from his biological counterpart, and I like him more than Cooler's other forms. Movie 7 - This is a must for me, Android 13, 14 and 15 must have their own universe  Movie 8 - We already have Broly, so no need for 2 Legendary Invincible Maniacs Movie 9 - We also have Bojack and his gang, I think you guys even remember the special we got for them Movie 10 - As I said, we have Broly. Movie 11 - This shouldn't even be mentioned Movie 12 - Janemba? I think everyone would love to see him in DBM. and Movie 13 - we have Hirudegarn and Tapion, so no need for them as well P.S Movie 14 and 15 shouldn't be a part of DBM (we already had a Beerus and Whis cameo) |
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Post by Andres on Aug 24, 2016 14:39:41 GMT
I'd love to see Gohan being raised as a proper Saiyan. Raditz kills Goku and Piccolo, but survives. Then, he takes Gohan to be his "pupil". Vegeta sees the huge potential in Gohan, and takes him in. And they all plot to overthrow Frieza. Gohan and Vegeta would train together and raise their power together.
And Gohan would be the first Super Saiyan, instead of Vegeta. He's more prone to rage and fury than both Goku and Vegeta, so why not?
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Post by Lord Rime on Aug 24, 2016 15:45:58 GMT
Hmm...
I think I'd want to see at least one example of a good - or at least not evil - Arcosian, though I'm not sure if it's justifiable to have an entire universe like that and frankly work seem like fan-wanking. Instead I think I'd just have Kuriza in U8, U9, or U2 (but only one of those three). U8 Kuriza is probably best.
U8 Kuriza stands out immediately in his first match by holding back an immense amount of power and deliberately not killing his foe (probably some hapless U10 Saiyan - bonus points if said Saiyan looks like/actually is Onnio), making the excuse to the rest of the Frost Demons that he doesn't want to get "weak blood" on his hands. U16/18 Piccolo, though, notes that he doesn't sense any evil ki from Kuriza. In his second match (I'm feeling...Nail, who doesn't forfeit after his first match) he actually has to transform to fight but, again, doesn't kill Nail once beating him. His third match (whom I have no idea who it could be against), he loses, of course, as he's simply outclassed by this point.
Now, aside from apparently being merciful, two things I'd add. One, in a lot of background shots showing U8, we'd see little hints that he's not feared and is actually kind of liked by the minions of U8, and also that's he's a nice guy. Like Burter giving him an ice cream cone or something; or when U16 Pan is killed, show Frieza, Cooler, and Cold all grinning wickedly, but Kuriza's eyes are closed and he's looking away. Second, he'd spend a lot of time hanging out in other universes. Ostensibly he'd be acting like a bratty kid in most of them but it'd become pretty clear that mostly he just doesn't want to spend time with his own family.
Oh, emphatically Kuriza would not be here to show a softer side of Frieza. He doesn't have one. If anything Kuriza's interactions with Frieza would reinforce that Frieza is a fundamentally sadistic, evil person.
If Kuriza got a wish on the Dragon Balls, he'd wish for the rest of his family to go away and never return.
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Post by Shady Doorags on Aug 27, 2016 5:02:15 GMT
1) A universe where future Gohan defeated the androids. He'd have Trunks with him. I wouldn't expect either of them to get far, given that they'd most likely only be able to go super saiyan, but it would've been a really touching moment to see Gohan reunite Goku and Trunks meet Vegeta.
2) A universe where Gohan continued training after defeating Cell. Seems to me, he'd be a great antithesis to Bra, especially since it's been shown that he's the only one who was able to calm her down and somewhat scare her. I imagine he would've eventually went SSj3 and understood it better than most. Gohan, when he defeated Cell, to me, was as top tier as a hero could get in the DBZ universe. He valued life, learned what being arrogant could cost him, and was smarter than any other warrior, meaning he'd have the best of brains and fighting skill.
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Post by jkrevan on Aug 27, 2016 20:48:15 GMT
I'd love to see Gohan being raised as a proper Saiyan. Raditz kills Goku and Piccolo, but survives. Then, he takes Gohan to be his "pupil". Vegeta sees the huge potential in Gohan, and takes him in. And they all plot to overthrow Frieza. Gohan and Vegeta would train together and raise their power together. And Gohan would be the first Super Saiyan, instead of Vegeta. He's more prone to rage and fury than both Goku and Vegeta, so why not? Hmm, what if goku's head injury wasnt THAT much of a brain-wipe. and instead of outright refusing Raditz, he actually took up the offer and went with gohan and joined the saiyan band? Or perhaps he went so raditz would spare the earth and hijinks ensue... it would be a U13 where Goku isnt that much of a psycho, and gohan is also there. |
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Post by Azoth on Aug 27, 2016 21:37:25 GMT
I'd love to see Gohan being raised as a proper Saiyan. Raditz kills Goku and Piccolo, but survives. Then, he takes Gohan to be his "pupil". Vegeta sees the huge potential in Gohan, and takes him in. And they all plot to overthrow Frieza. Gohan and Vegeta would train together and raise their power together. And Gohan would be the first Super Saiyan, instead of Vegeta. He's more prone to rage and fury than both Goku and Vegeta, so why not? |
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Post by Son Pan on Aug 28, 2016 22:01:29 GMT
I would want to add a universe where Freeza killed Goku immediately after he survived the Spirit Bomb. The major difference between this universe and universe 8 would be that Freeza would have been shaken to his core at how he almost died. He would realize that despite being so powerful a small group of warriors three of whom he had no idea existed became powerful enough to force him to use his true form to win. Freeza would realize it is possible for someone outside his family to reach his power. This would do two things, 1) It would cause Freeza to start training to become as strong as possible. 2)Freeza would continue his immortality quest by traveling the universe to look for alternative methods. As a result of Freeza's interest in training Cooler and Cold would also begin to train to get ahead or stay ahead for dominance. Frost Demons or whatever you want to call them can stay the dominate power by increasing their powers, which could help them prepare for other existing villains in the universe that are stronger than them. Freeza's immortal quest could take him all over the universe looking for beings with special powers or magic that could help. It would provide a lot of fun space adventures and allow Freeza to learn different techniques or abilities in his quest to stave off death. It could be possible for Freeza to find new rivals that could challenge his power, thus fuel the need to train more. Freeza and his family would have to deal with threats to their power like Broly or Bababdi and Dabura and overcome them, which is what the specials involving this universe would deal with.
I want to see this universe because Freeza is one of the only few races IMO that can compete with the Saiyans. They can survive in any environment (at least from what were told) and Freeza was half dead and just a torso, but survived Namek exploding, and they had an enormous power. Imagine if Freeza or Cooler had trained as long and as hard as Goku and Vegeta that it is possible they would be as strong as they were by the end of Z. It wouldn't be as exaggerated as Resurrected F which having Freeza train for a few months to make enormous leaps surpassing anything the other canon characters could do, but it shows that just because the Super Saiyans surpassed them does not mean Freeza couldn't get stronger. It would have made for a more entertaining or cool grudge match to set up a Super Freeza against U18 Vegeta. It gives the prince a chance to shine by destroying the person he hated most while giving us a entertaining match since Freeza who could give him a real challenge.
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Post by Symbiotic on Aug 29, 2016 7:05:32 GMT
I would want to add a universe where Freeza killed Goku immediately after he survived the Spirit Bomb. The major difference between this universe and universe 8 would be that Freeza would have been shaken to his core at how he almost died. He would realize that despite being so powerful a small group of warriors three of whom he had no idea existed became powerful enough to force him to use his true form to win. Freeza would realize it is possible for someone outside his family to reach his power. This would do two things, 1) It would cause Freeza to start training to become as strong as possible. 2)Freeza would continue his immortality quest by traveling the universe to look for alternative methods. As a result of Freeza's interest in training Cooler and Cold would also begin to train to get ahead or stay ahead for dominance. Frost Demons or whatever you want to call them can stay the dominate power by increasing their powers, which could help them prepare for other existing villains in the universe that are stronger than them. Freeza's immortal quest could take him all over the universe looking for beings with special powers or magic that could help. It would provide a lot of fun space adventures and allow Freeza to learn different techniques or abilities in his quest to stave off death. It could be possible for Freeza to find new rivals that could challenge his power, thus fuel the need to train more. Freeza and his family would have to deal with threats to their power like Broly or Bababdi and Dabura and overcome them, which is what the specials involving this universe would deal with.
I want to see this universe because Freeza is one of the only few races IMO that can compete with the Saiyans. They can survive in any environment (at least from what were told) and Freeza was half dead and just a torso, but survived Namek exploding, and they had an enormous power. Imagine if Freeza or Cooler had trained as long and as hard as Goku and Vegeta that it is possible they would be as strong as they were by the end of Z. It wouldn't be as exaggerated as Resurrected F which having Freeza train for a few months to make enormous leaps surpassing anything the other canon characters could do, but it shows that just because the Super Saiyans surpassed them does not mean Freeza couldn't get stronger. It would have made for a more entertaining or cool grudge match to set up a Super Freeza against U18 Vegeta. It gives the prince a chance to shine by destroying the person he hated most while giving us a entertaining match since Freeza who could give him a real challenge.
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Post by Roketto on Sept 5, 2016 2:50:39 GMT
Hmm... I think I'd want to see at least one example of a good - or at least not evil - Arcosian, though I'm not sure if it's justifiable to have an entire universe like that and frankly work seem like fan-wanking. Instead I think I'd just have Kuriza in U8, U9, or U2 (but only one of those three). U8 Kuriza is probably best. U8 Kuriza stands out immediately in his first match by holding back an immense amount of power and deliberately not killing his foe (probably some hapless U10 Saiyan - bonus points if said Saiyan looks like/actually is Onnio), making the excuse to the rest of the Frost Demons that he doesn't want to get "weak blood" on his hands. U16/18 Piccolo, though, notes that he doesn't sense any evil ki from Kuriza. In his second match (I'm feeling...Nail, who doesn't forfeit after his first match) he actually has to transform to fight but, again, doesn't kill Nail once beating him. His third match (whom I have no idea who it could be against), he loses, of course, as he's simply outclassed by this point. Now, aside from apparently being merciful, two things I'd add. One, in a lot of background shots showing U8, we'd see little hints that he's not feared and is actually kind of liked by the minions of U8, and also that's he's a nice guy. Like Burter giving him an ice cream cone or something; or when U16 Pan is killed, show Frieza, Cooler, and Cold all grinning wickedly, but Kuriza's eyes are closed and he's looking away. Second, he'd spend a lot of time hanging out in other universes. Ostensibly he'd be acting like a bratty kid in most of them but it'd become pretty clear that mostly he just doesn't want to spend time with his own family. Oh, emphatically Kuriza would not be here to show a softer side of Frieza. He doesn't have one. If anything Kuriza's interactions with Frieza would reinforce that Frieza is a fundamentally sadistic, evil person. If Kuriza got a wish on the Dragon Balls, he'd wish for the rest of his family to go away and never return. I love this idea SO MUCH. Seriously, Kuriza may have been a gag manga character, but he has so much darn potential, it's not even funny. Personally, I'd rather instead of Fukkatsu no F going how it did, it would be Kuriza wishing back his father to try to put an end to some civil war going on in the remains of the PTO. Then he realizes that his father is more obsessed with petty revenge than ruling, & sides with Goku & co. to knock some sense into him. Also, I like your version of U8, where Kuriza is even more of a black sheep than Kooler, but because he's Frieza's spawn, nobody calls him out on it, besides his father & grandfather expressing annoyance over how soft he is.
@ pan:
Oh shoot, Reign was pretty fantastic. I second your motion; go read that masterpiece now.
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Post by GreatWyrmGold on Sept 11, 2016 14:20:40 GMT
Come to think of it, it really is startling that Dr. Gero hasn't shown up in DBM in any way--not even a reference. Gero was so creepily evil that I think it was a bad idea for Toriyama to kill him off so early. I've heard that Toriyama wrote Gero and 19 out of the plot after one of his old editors pointed out that an old man and the Pillsbury Doughbot weren't exactly the most intimidating nemeses Goku could face. After Frieza, that would have kinda been a step down, don't you think? I feel like the U6 girls would be more interesting if Salagir spent time developing them. And U2 performed the (questionably) important narrative purpose of lightening the tone in the early part of the comic. So, either "Who needs the past?" Gohan or "Who needs to be a productive and responsible member of society?" Gohan. The first has some potential depending on how he does it, but the latter sounds more interesting to me. Gohan probably wouldn't be exactly the warrior his old man is; he'd have the same incredible strength and SSJ and so on, but he'd be fighting for different reasons. Meanwhile, Chi-Chi would be raising Goten the way she did Gohan, only not trying so much to keep Goku involved in raising him. This might mean he doesn't hang out so much with Trunks, but Goku might take Gohan to train with Vegeta and Trunks...a good writer could probably find something to do with that. 2) A universe where Gohan continued training after defeating Cell. Seems to me, he'd be a great antithesis to Bra, especially since it's been shown that he's the only one who was able to calm her down and somewhat scare her. Ooh, nice thought. That would be hilarious. I'd love to see Gohan being raised as a proper Saiyan. Raditz kills Goku and Piccolo, but survives. Then, he takes Gohan to be his "pupil". Vegeta sees the huge potential in Gohan, and takes him in. And they all plot to overthrow Frieza. Gohan and Vegeta would train together and raise their power together. And Gohan would be the first Super Saiyan, instead of Vegeta. He's more prone to rage and fury than both Goku and Vegeta, so why not? Eh...sounds a bit much like U13 for my tastes. As for what I'd want, personally? Well, first I'd like the universes to be fleshed out better, but I'm in the middle of writing up a detailed thing about that, so I won't dwell on it. I'll just note that I'd probably change the existing universes a lot to make the characters and worlds more divergent and deep. But what universes would I add? Hm... Well, I'd probably toss in one GT-based universe—maybe one where Baby wins or something. GT was a terrible show, but it had some potentially interesting ideas. I'd also squeeze in some more DB-based ones (say, what if the Red Ribbon Army won, letting Dr. Gero create several more combat cyborgs to fight the rest of the universe with?), and at least one where things go the same general direction for completely different reasons. I might also sneak in a universe or a few based on works similar to Dragon Ball. |
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Post by kinnikuman on Sept 11, 2016 15:45:56 GMT
I would love to see a universe where the RR army was lead by Black. Instead of using stupid tactics Black would wish for Immortality. Son Goku's fight ends up being a stalemate and he has to flee. One year later a Revised Black Pants army finds and makes there wish to control the world Government, making a legit super police force lead by Mercanary robotic Tao. Tien would join the Black Pants army and so would his master Crane. Both the Z warriors and BP army would fight but join together against world ending threats.
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Post by Andres on Sept 15, 2016 16:43:07 GMT
I'd love to see Gohan being raised as a proper Saiyan. Raditz kills Goku and Piccolo, but survives. Then, he takes Gohan to be his "pupil". Vegeta sees the huge potential in Gohan, and takes him in. And they all plot to overthrow Frieza. Gohan and Vegeta would train together and raise their power together. And Gohan would be the first Super Saiyan, instead of Vegeta. He's more prone to rage and fury than both Goku and Vegeta, so why not? Nice!! Lemme get on with that |
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Post by Kaio del Norte on Sept 15, 2016 17:41:53 GMT
As said before, a universel where Gohan became a Saiyan warrior and helped Vegeta defeat Frieza would have been pretty nice. I can imagine him having childhood flashbacks after meeting U16 and U18, a little bit like U13 Kakarotto with U9 Krilin.
Also a universe in which Dr.Gero has total control over all of his cyborgs/androids would have been pretty fun to watch. Although he wouldn't be so different than Raichi or Babidi.
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Post by Kaio del Norte on Sept 17, 2016 19:06:04 GMT
A universe with Mystic Satan!
Dende and the Kaioshins don't forget Satan in the Kaioshinkai while Goku and Vegeta fight Buu to eventually lose without the help of Satan. Buu goes back to Earth and destroy it before Gohan or Gotenks can do anything. All the Z-fighters dead and having no other last resort the Old Kaioshin gives the mystic power to Satan. Ta-dam!!
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Post by fooshin on Sept 17, 2016 20:09:57 GMT
A universe with Mystic Satan! Dende and the Kaioshins don't forget Satan in the Kaioshinkai while Goku and Vegeta fight Buu to eventually lose without the help of Satan. Buu goes back to Earth and destroy it before Gohan or Gotenks can do anything. All the Z-fighters dead and having no other last resort the Old Kaioshin gives the mystic power to Satan. Ta-dam!! Oh, I'd say for his potential... should take about 10 seconds. |
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Post by Axalon on Sept 17, 2016 21:26:13 GMT
A universe with Mystic Satan! Dende and the Kaioshins don't forget Satan in the Kaioshinkai while Goku and Vegeta fight Buu to eventually lose without the help of Satan. Buu goes back to Earth and destroy it before Gohan or Gotenks can do anything. All the Z-fighters dead and having no other last resort the Old Kaioshin gives the mystic power to Satan. Ta-dam!! Oh, I'd say for his potential... should take about 10 seconds. I agree. He's so powerful already that the Old Kai just wouldn't have much to coax out, unlike Gohan. |
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Post by Jaquan on Sept 19, 2016 22:18:17 GMT
Oh, I'd say for his potential... should take about 10 seconds. I agree. He's so powerful already that the Old Kai just wouldn't have much to coax out, unlike Gohan. We can't be too sure about it. Sure Satan is one who trained a lot but all he did was basic physical training. He lacked any spiritual one so I'd say there is still quite some room for him to improve. Take note that Krillin who also trained his whole life was convinced he can go no further and yet received quite a boost from Elder Guru's inferior potential draw. |
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