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Post by Son Pan on Jun 16, 2017 8:08:24 GMT
It is obvious we all have our own ideas on what we would have liked to have seen these series revisited. We might as well have an official thread on it where we can come to discuss our ideas. Maybe it will led to a collaboration with people coming together to make their own stories that could be the next DBM in the future. Who knows? Let's have fun with it. I'll start things off by saying this series should have been set after the last episode of Z.
Beerus coming to fight the Super Saiyan God after Z doesn't really change a whole lot. Most of BoG can stay the same with maybe only minor changes at best. It gives the opportunity to have new characters like Uub, Pan, and Bra to get screen time. You don't have to worry about trying to keep Super in line with the original ending at all. The anime already altered the movie in small ways I really see no point in keeping it set in between the 10 years between Majin Buu's defeat and Goku taking Uub as his student. That's what I would do for starters. I'll think of more later. Interested in seeing other people's ideas too.
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Post by The Retro Kakarotto on Jun 16, 2017 9:14:13 GMT
I'll stay relative to Beerus' introduction in the anime before discussion any future sagas.
The fact that he wakes up "earlier than usual" (easy to fix if we kept it after EoZ) means he should be unprepared for his duties. That being said, I feel like his powers displayed during the BoG saga should've reflected his "early awakening" so that we would have a more realistic reason as to why Beerus is always so strong than G&V in the later arcs.
Whis: "He is now stronger than when you fought him in the red form, Son Goku, because him being sleepy for so long he couldn't tap into his power that easily. Yes Goku, he's that strong. Ugh, so annoying with your questions."
But he's the same cat that fought SSJG Goku and "sought a challenge" out of the Saiyan in his prophecy, yet if he's really stronger than a SSJB, why did he want a challenge like that in the first place? (In universe reason, not because of "didn't think of it yet" reason)
His strength in BoG should be his "sleepy stage" and not his full power. After realizing he can't get anymore sleep (in the RoF he's in his pjs) he'll try to stay awake. Him always eating (but not getting fat like Champa) and sleeping would make him out of shape or at least not at the same level of activeness he was before his slumber. Alternately he could resume his training with Whis to stay ahead of Goku and Vegeta and (again) this would justify his strength "always ahead of the main characters" and such statements.
More about his life link and later sagas when other people have a shot at Beerus... (HA!... Mai's Gun.)
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Post by Ashanark on Jun 16, 2017 20:04:59 GMT
Is it bad that I think about this all the time? Baby and the Shadow Dragons are good enough concepts to deserve getting redone, and U6 tournament and Zamasu could use another look, too.
Super:
-- God ki isn't a power boost; Beerus' strength has nothing to do with him having god ki. This keeps the power scaling lower.
-- SSG, if it exists, looks different, and is only a temporary powerup, not a true form. SSB doesn't exist.
-- BoG takes place immediately before EoZ. Losing to Beerus is why Goku finds and trains Uub: he thinks Uub could surpass him and beat Beerus.
-- Uub, Pan, Goten, and the other younger people are the primary heroes.
-- RoF doesn't happen.
-- U7 loses the tournament against U6, and Earth get transported to U6. This allows for a ton of other adventures and worldbuilding. Goku gets to know Champa and Vados. Vegeta gets to know the U6 Saiyans. Frost is actually a good guy.
-- ToP lineup is: Gohan, Goten, Trunks, Krillin, 17, 18, Tien, Buu, Piccolo, and...Future Trunks, I suppose. (With stipulations.) Goku and Vegeta are off fighting Zamasu or something, letting the others shine and making the situation more tense.
-- For Zamasu saga, get rid of Future Trunks and all time travel shenanigans. The story takes place in the present day, raising the stakes and allowing more people to be involved. This necessitates Zamasu and Black being retooled to become different people. If Goku and Vegeta fuse, they use Fusion Dance so as to prevent a crappy Potara retcon.
GT
-- Baby isn't called Baby.
-- Baby takes over Goku, not Vegeta, so as to give Uub a chance to show he can best his mentor.
-- There are more fights against parasite-infected people before this. It gives us an excuse to have people fight each other which we've always wanted to see, like a Trunks-Goten rematch, Gohan vs. Gotenks, or something similar.
-- Uub, Pan, and the younger folk are the heroes.
-- If combining Super with GT, then Shadow Dragons are formed from the Super Dragon Balls, explaining their strength. They don't necessarily keep the "I was formed from [insert here] wish," however.
-- Whether this is a GT-only redo or a combined story, Shadow Dragons are the final opponents.
-- The Z-Fighters split into seven teams to hunt down the Shadow Dragons: Goku with Uub, Gohan with Pan, Vegeta with Bulla, Goten with Trunks, Krillin with 18, Piccolo with 17, Buu with Hercule. Each one is given a dragon to beat. (Or, instead of Krillin, have the teams be Goten with Piccolo, 17 with 18, and Trunks with Future Trunks.)
-- The dragons are redesigned so they don't all look stupid. The final dragon, whoever he is, isn't killed by Spirit Bomb, because Buu was killed that way.
In all cases, the scale of power is ramped up so it's clear the characters are stronger than they were in the Buu saga.
OPTION: Combining Zamasu with Baby
I literally just came up with this while writing this post.
-- Gowasu learns Zeno will erase eight universes, including his own.
-- Zamasu tries to get mortals to improve so as to raise the "mortal level" of his universe, and gets frustrated at human frailty.
-- Zamasu thinks it's unfair that the "perfect," not-alive things of creation will have to be destroyed due to mortal weakness.
-- He realizes that most of the gods are incompetent. (U9 comes to mind.)
-- He uses the Super Dragon Balls to find out a way to save creation. The result of his wish is Black (Baby), a parasite that can take over mortals and make them do Zamasu's bidding.
-- The first notable host of Baby in U7 is Goku.
-- Black is the main threat of the saga, but he takes orders from Zamasu and shares his ideals, having been created by the SDBs to be his servant.
-- In trying to find out what's wrong with Goku, the Z-Fighters come to learn about the existence of the parasite Black, and then about the rogue Kaioshin he calls his master.
Ideally, this saga would preserve Zamasu's character, have a Black that has the same personality as the official one, give more characters more things to do, and be a way to have high stakes without anyone actually dying (Baby/Black taking over everyone.) Baby's original concept of a Tuffle creation (which was a rehash of Raichi), is dropped in favor of being a Kaioshin servant.
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Post by Griffith on Jun 17, 2017 10:06:12 GMT
You know, I've always enjoyed the idea that in ROF for Freeza to reach the tier of power he did in the movie he would have to become a God. Maybe, his God ritual would be reaching the heart of a star? In fact I'd even expand on God Ki in general, in order to become a God you would have to become everything your race is not. So, for Saiyans who are bastards you would have to be pure of heart, and link with five other pure of heart Saiyans (I'd even go and say that once a Saiyan does the God Ritual they can never do it again.)
For the Frost Demons being a race of weaklings their Trial to becoming a God would be a test of great strength, and endurance. Freeza can still reach a titanic tier of strength in this rewrite without the boost in power offered by the God Ritual. He'll surpass Ultimate Gohan's tier of strength. I'd also place his Resurrection around the Buu saga so he has plenty of time to train, and have it not be a stupidly fast growth in power.
And for all intents and purposes Battle Of God would take place after End Of Z.
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Post by Symbiotic on Jun 17, 2017 10:53:58 GMT
I have my own plans for a DBS/GT redo that I'll roll out once Super is done and I have time to sift through the remains. There are good ideas on this thread, and I'd suggest taking a look at the-devils-corpse on deviantart for more ideas.
But seeing this thread made me wonder how one could do a version of Super that came after the events of GT. Beerus would be woken up because of the negative energy about to destroy the universe, and arrives on Earth after Goku leaves with Shenron. Golden Frieza comes about because of Champa and Vados empowering him to screw over U7's strongest warriors before the tournament is made. I, uh, have absolutely nothing after that.
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Post by Son Pan on Jun 21, 2017 0:18:12 GMT
After thinking about it for a little bit I think most of the changes I would make to the Battle of Gods arc would probably be minor ones. This more nitpicking then anything and wouldn't change things drastically, but I think these changes might have a bigger impact on the series as it went on and could possibly make things run smoother in the future. I would change Beerus' motivation from wanting to fight Super Saiyan God into fighting the mortal that defeated Majin Buu. This would allow the story to explain why Beerus didn't stop Buu millions of years ago and why the Supreme Kai fought alone.
In my revised story it would be revealed that the Grand Supreme Kai did go to Beerus for help against Buu when his rampage started to spread across the universe, but got turned down. Beerus would be unimpressed by Buu at first and just see him as generic would be destroyer who wasn't worth his time. This establishes Beerus is more of an amoral god who lusts for a good battle and less of champion of good god like the Kai to explain why Beerus doesn't just kill every villain in the past or future. It also throws the Supreme Kai a bone, by showing their leader had foresight to ask for Beerus' help long before Bibidi set his sights on the Supreme Kai. It makes the Kai's last stand and attempts to stop Buu more tragic and sad, since they did exhaust other resources to try to stop Buu for the sake of the universe only to be rejected. It makes their stand even more heroic since they are willing to fight with or without reassurance from Beerus. It doesn't really make Beerus look worse either considering he is supposed to be amoral and selfish, yet his cool factor would still endear fans to him. Beerus would only gain interest in Buu at all after he learned of how Buu killed 4/5 Supreme Kai. That would give him hope that Buu might prove a worthy opponent. Of course he never fights Buu, because by the time he learns of this Shin will have already killed Bibidi after Majin Buu was sealed away. After being deprived of the battle he craved Beerus destroys a galaxy or two in sheer frustration then goes into a long hibernation that lasts for millions of years. This establishes Beerus' short temper and unpredictable personality and why he wasn't around when Buu was unsealed.
Like I mentioned before the events of the arc would take place after the DBZ, set a few years after Goku started training Uub. The gang still gather for Bulma's birthday. The party is a good way to reintroduce the characters and give us a glimpse in what they've been up to.
Goku is trains Uub, but both are staying at his house. There is really no reason for why Goku can't do both. Uub becomes a honorary member of the family.
Pan developed a bit of rivalry with Uub, since Goku spends so much time with him. In the end Gohan would train her instead, which gives Gohan a strong sparring partner to stay in shape with and allows him to bond with his daughter.
Vegeta accomplished SS3, but has dialed down the crazy training hours to spend time with his family, showing him more balanced and having more time to spend with Bra and Bulma.
Yamecha married to someone and enjoying his retirement days, because he needs a break.
Krillin and 18 have their own place. etc.
Goku gets called away by the Supreme Kai. They explain to him who Beerus is and have him fight Beerus on their planet. The danger is since Beerus built up these unrealistic expectations on how powerful Majin Buu is that when he sees how weak Goku (the man who defeated Buu) is compared to him that he might go on another rampage and take his frustrations out on the universe. The Supreme Kai bringing Goku to their world hope if Beerus gets upset that he'll take it out on their realm rather than the universe on a whole. Goku would let it slip that he has strong friends (some who might be stronger than him), so when Beerus beats him easily he just moves to Earth. Things play out pretty similar to how they did in the movie only to have Old Kai and Goku stop Beerus. They broker a deal with Whis to give them a year to learn and harness god ki to give Beerus a better fight. A group of Goku, Vegeta, Piccolo, Gohan, Uub, and Goten and Trunks go with Old Kai to learn about god ki, while Beerus and Whis stay on Earth to wait for them. This way we could learn more about what god ki is and have the fighters train to obtain and master it, while Beerus staying on Earth acts as both a threat and excuse for zany Beerus food antics and fights with Buu over it.
Beerus gets fed up and demands a fight after six months. No one is ready for it yet, but Goku is the closest one to learning to harness god ki. That is when Whis tells them about a divine ritual would allow one person to temporary become empowered by god ki and transform into a unstable god form. It does away with Saiyan exclusive Super Saiyan God form, but still lets the red form get show cased once. Goku and Beerus fight plays out the same way, except maybe when Goku temporarily unlocks god ki on his own once the red from goes out he goes SSB. Even though Goku loses Beerus is impressed enough to take Goku as his student. Vegeta goes to Whis for training so as not to fall behind. Things are setup for future arcs.
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Post by Azoth on Jun 21, 2017 20:21:59 GMT
I've been toying with ideas for redeeming Zamasu, doing for him what SoD does for Frieza.
One of my main sticking points is having to revisit the Zamasu Saga, and we've seen enough of that.
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Post by Symbiotic on Jun 21, 2017 20:42:55 GMT
I've been toying with ideas for redeeming Zamasu, doing for him what SoD does for Frieza. One of my main sticking points is having to revisit the Zamasu Saga, and we've seen enough of that. Just do it. The stations of canon have been gone over so many times in fanfiction that everything from Super will still be fresh material for most readers. If there are people still willing to read Raditz redemption tale #9002 you don't have to worry about arc fatigue. |
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Post by Son Pan on Jun 26, 2017 6:54:01 GMT
Since Super reintroduce gods and gave them new importance in the series it would be cool to expand on the god system more. I thought of eight god classifications that could be used in the story.
1. Gods of Order
2. Gods of Destruction
3. Gods of Creation
4. Gods of Chaos
5. Gods of Life
6. Gods of Time
7. Gods of Death
8. Gods of Space
Each god serves a specific function that controls or manage the universe on a whole. The functions are different, yet of equal importance could open the stage for returning diverse abilities back into the series and do more world building to explore potential story ideas later. They don't even need to be the only god classes in the series, but it opens the door to a bigger universe if need be and not to force everything on one or two gods like we have now. It paths the way for newer supporting cast members or antagonists. A richer pantheon of deities can never really hurt. I mentioned this in another thread, but I would totally reorganize the Kai into being Gods of Order. It fits their original roles in the series better than creators do. God of Creation being an entirely new character doesn't hurt anything and gives the audience a new character to meet in the future, someone to act as Beerus' foil better than the Kai.
Each of the gods linked to each other in a yin yang still. The only difference here is the Supreme Kai would be linked to Gods of Chaos and Beerus would be linked to a different God of Creation. Life and Death would be linked. Space and Time would be linked. Everything is still balanced on a cosmic level. Potential friendships and rivalries among the groups would be a driving force in the series and even used to explain future story arcs or threats.
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Post by Son Pan on Oct 20, 2017 4:46:03 GMT
I would scrap Resurrection F arc altogether. Freeza is popular, but reviving him serves no real purpose and makes a headache with power scaling. I would redo Baby arc for Super, but modify it to make it work better. The remnants of Planet Trade Organization still come to Earth with the goal of reviving Freeza, but they get stopped by the heroes easily. Through them that they learn of Machine Mutant Empire. They have been taking over Freeza's old empire and slowly dominating planets and galaxies across the universe. They wanted to revive Freeza in hopes of him defeating the Empire. One of the MME ships comes to Earth looking for old Freeza goons. They prove themselves to be extremely powerful, defeating Piccolo, Goten, and Pan, before Uub and Gohan stop them, it alerts the rest of empire and puts Earth in target range. The gang learn from the PTO that MME will send an invasion team made up of thousands of ships to conquer the Earth and absorb the population. Since they never faced an invasion of that size and fearing they may be overwhelmed by sheer numbers everyone decides to send a team into space with PTO to fight the MME in space, while they keep team on Earth to act as defense and gather the Dragon Balls ready in case they need to use wishes to relocate Earth.
This way you can explore space in more depth, the setting lends itself into creating newer characters, abilities, powers, and races, it potentially could lead to going to Freeza's home planet to learn more about his race and people that live there. We can see the galactic police in action. Baby for me would be re-imagined instead of being a hive mind program, similar to the Borg from Star Trek. It infects people, converts them into machine mutates, enhances them to make them better. It is a different type of villain for DB and the threat is with each race or person it assimilates it evolves to make the whole unit stronger. It lends itself to having a large array of villains at different levels, so even weaker fighters have someone to face. The turning point of the arc would be Baby infecting Goku and making him its main body with all Goku's techniques and god ki intact. You get the idea of villain taking over Goku's body and being a villain with Black, drama over Goku being turned against his friends and family, and gives Vegeta the chance to be the hero. The climactic battle would be Baby Goku vs. Vegeta. Other characters like Uub, Pan, Maron, Buu, and Goten work together to free the other friends that were assimilated.
That could fill out 26 episodes easily enough. It could be a good space adventure, with some elements of horror with Baby. You can still have Beerus and Whis as supporting characters. They could train Vegeta for final battle with Baby Goku, explain why they won't get involve behind that to make sure the audience knows Beerus just won't come in to save the day, kill tension. The setting allows for almost all of the characters to do something of significance. It is a story arc that can start off small and gradually grow as tensions rise. It gets the gang cred as space heroes, which would go a long way in explaining why Earth gets so much attention in the series.
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