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Post by The Masterman on Oct 4, 2016 1:43:16 GMT
A tard? Listen up. 1. I like Beerus, Whis, Hit, Cooler,Cell, and Gogeta. Are they tanked like Broly? 2. We need new tournament people because Vargas don't make the cut. 1 - Lamentably for you, Beerus, Whiss, Hit and Gogeta (thus far) do not exist in this tournament. Cell has an unfair advantage which is regeneration, and let's remember: anyone who doesn't fight only using brute strengt was shit for you, no? 2 - Nah, I don't think so. We really don't, especially not NOW after 1000 pages have passed. Perhaps you need to only watch DBS instead. I think I understand what kind of tourny he wants Khan, the ones that were shown in the karate kid movies. You know the ones where you can only attack with "standard martial arts moves" and you get penalised for messing up and it's not based on fighting but scoring points which would be hella boring to see.
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Post by Conqueror Geng on Oct 4, 2016 3:17:16 GMT
1 - Lamentably for you, Beerus, Whiss, Hit and Gogeta (thus far) do not exist in this tournament. Cell has an unfair advantage which is regeneration, and let's remember: anyone who doesn't fight only using brute strengt was shit for you, no? 2 - Nah, I don't think so. We really don't, especially not NOW after 1000 pages have passed. Perhaps you need to only watch DBS instead. I think I understand what kind of tourny he wants Khan, the ones that were shown in the karate kid movies. You know the ones where you can only attack with "standard martial arts moves" and you get penalised for messing up and it's not based on fighting but scoring points which would be hella boring to see. Seems like the dude wants a Tae-Kwon-Do championship, where only kicks from certain angles are allowed as excellency movements, and you have to use globes, pads and a helmet to avoid serious injuries.
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Post by ltsarge on Oct 4, 2016 5:08:43 GMT
So I saw this panel count thread, and noticed bra ranking in the top on every list, usually at number one. I think this contributes toto why I dislike her so much is her having such a heavy presence in the series over so many canon characters. dbmenglish.freeforums.net/thread/18/dbm-panel-count
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Post by sardorim on Oct 4, 2016 12:55:56 GMT
Her personality and skills are 100% consistent with her age and background if you ask me. You might like her or not but keep in mind she isn't meant to be likeable. She is better than that: she is realistic! Now, I think most haters have obvious personal issues regarding women. If you think she is too much the centre of attention in the comic that's a valid, debatable opinion. But comments like 'she needs to get punished lmfao fuckin cunt mary sue' or 'she needs to do girly stuff and a man' only confirm your passive-aggressive beta maleness. Grow a pair, boys. Not to mention the amount of physical violence and hate she gets thrown towards her by her haters until the mods have to do theur daily page cleaning. I'm still shocked that those demanding Bra be raped aren't instantly ip banned on the main dbm website as the same ones keel coming back repeating the same thing every page that features Bra. The community has no place for such types of monstrosities. On another note, it was hilarious when her haters confused U18 Bra with U16 Bra and ranted their irrational hatred only to get schooled when someone pointed out their rehearsed lines being automated at this point as they didn't even bother reading anything. All they knew that a Bra was there so they rushed to post hate, violence and rape demands about Bra as soon as the page released. Not even the Bra they say they hate. Still same vulgar antics regardless and not one Bra haters called them out on it. Heck, It's frustrating how no Bra haters ever calls out other Bra haters when they get into a frenzy demanding Bra be raped. No male character ever gets such things said towards them. Just Bra and occasionally other female characters to a lesser extent. Bet you that if Bra wasn't hot they wouldn't demand her rape as it seems to me that they're just projecting the violent thoughts they wish to partake upon Bra, who is an attractive powerful woman, themselves which seriously worries me on how they view strong women in real life who aren't meek and submissive towards them.
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Post by opiomorph on Oct 4, 2016 14:39:10 GMT
Her personality and skills are 100% consistent with her age and background if you ask me. You might like her or not but keep in mind she isn't meant to be likeable. She is better than that: she is realistic! Now, I think most haters have obvious personal issues regarding women. If you think she is too much the centre of attention in the comic that's a valid, debatable opinion. But comments like 'she needs to get punished lmfao fuckin cunt mary sue' or 'she needs to do girly stuff and a man' only confirm your passive-aggressive beta maleness. Grow a pair, boys. Not to mention the amount of physical violence and hate she gets thrown towards her by her haters until the mods have to do theur daily page cleaning. I'm still shocked that those demanding Bra be raped aren't instantly ip banned on the main dbm website as the same ones keel coming back repeating the same thing every page that features Bra. The community has no place for such types of monstrosities. On another note, it was hilarious when her haters confused U18 Bra with U16 Bra and ranted their irrational hatred only to get schooled when someone pointed out their rehearsed lines being automated at this point as they didn't even bother reading anything. All they knew that a Bra was there so they rushed to post hate, violence and rape demands about Bra as soon as the page released. Not even the Bra they say they hate. Still same vulgar antics regardless and not one Bra haters called them out on it. Heck, It's frustrating how no Bra haters ever calls out other Bra haters when they get into a frenzy demanding Bra be raped. No male character ever gets such things said towards them. Just Bra and occasionally other female characters to a lesser extent. Bet you that if Bra wasn't hot they wouldn't demand her rape as it seems to me that they're just projecting the violent thoughts they wish to partake upon Bra, who is an attractive powerful woman, themselves which seriously worries me on how they view strong women in real life who aren't meek and submissive towards them. Ummm, are you the ebin troll Yoko from the comment section ? The post format is identical, a passive aggressive message opened with Bra wank as an excuse, followed by an attack on her critics, flanderizing them all into sexist rapists You are eerily similar all the way down to what words you use and how you structure your sentences.
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Post by ltsarge on Oct 4, 2016 14:52:42 GMT
Her personality and skills are 100% consistent with her age and background if you ask me. You might like her or not but keep in mind she isn't meant to be likeable. She is better than that: she is realistic! Now, I think most haters have obvious personal issues regarding women. If you think she is too much the centre of attention in the comic that's a valid, debatable opinion. But comments like 'she needs to get punished lmfao fuckin cunt mary sue' or 'she needs to do girly stuff and a man' only confirm your passive-aggressive beta maleness. Grow a pair, boys. Not to mention the amount of physical violence and hate she gets thrown towards her by her haters until the mods have to do theur daily page cleaning. I'm still shocked that those demanding Bra be raped aren't instantly ip banned on the main dbm website as the same ones keel coming back repeating the same thing every page that features Bra. The community has no place for such types of monstrosities. On another note, it was hilarious when her haters confused U18 Bra with U16 Bra and ranted their irrational hatred only to get schooled when someone pointed out their rehearsed lines being automated at this point as they didn't even bother reading anything. All they knew that a Bra was there so they rushed to post hate, violence and rape demands about Bra as soon as the page released. Not even the Bra they say they hate. Still same vulgar antics regardless and not one Bra haters called them out on it. Heck, It's frustrating how no Bra haters ever calls out other Bra haters when they get into a frenzy demanding Bra be raped. No male character ever gets such things said towards them. Just Bra and occasionally other female characters to a lesser extent. Bet you that if Bra wasn't hot they wouldn't demand her rape as it seems to me that they're just projecting the violent thoughts they wish to partake upon Bra, who is an attractive powerful woman, themselves which seriously worries me on how they view strong women in real life who aren't meek and submissive towards them. Who's been saying they want to see Bra raped? Not that I really care too much, cause creepers gonna creep, and some folks just say stuff like "Oh, you been raped" or make a TFS quote. But I really haven't seen the Bra rape pandemic in either forums. Do you have screen caps or links to pages?
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2016 15:25:23 GMT
Frankly, Dragonball in general was in desperate need for a character like U16 Bra. She is such a polarising enigma. I think it is hilarious coz she is basically a teenage female Vegeta that fights against genocide instead of gettin off on it, but is considered a cunt that has to change.
I sincerely hope she stays the way she is.
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Post by ltsarge on Oct 4, 2016 15:42:51 GMT
Frankly, Dragonball in general was in desperate need for a character like U16 Bra. She is such a polarising enigma. I think it is hilarious coz she is basically a teenage female Vegeta that fights against genocide instead of gettin off on it, but is considered a cunt that has to change. I sincerely hope she stays the way she is. I don't get how Dragonball was in desperate need of a character like Bra. But that's just me. As for her being like Vegeta, I mentioned in another thread, she basically berserks out and treats everyone like shit, much like vegeta, but none of the other characters comment on it. We really need a TFS Tien like character to comment on Bra, pointing out how much a brat she is, much like how Tien points out how much a jerk and arrogant smug ass Vegeta is.
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Post by Conqueror Geng on Oct 4, 2016 17:16:05 GMT
Her personality and skills are 100% consistent with her age and background if you ask me. You might like her or not but keep in mind she isn't meant to be likeable. She is better than that: she is realistic! Now, I think most haters have obvious personal issues regarding women. If you think she is too much the centre of attention in the comic that's a valid, debatable opinion. But comments like 'she needs to get punished lmfao fuckin cunt mary sue' or 'she needs to do girly stuff and a man' only confirm your passive-aggressive beta maleness. Grow a pair, boys. Not to mention the amount of physical violence and hate she gets thrown towards her by her haters until the mods have to do theur daily page cleaning. I'm still shocked that those demanding Bra be raped aren't instantly ip banned on the main dbm website as the same ones keel coming back repeating the same thing every page that features Bra. The community has no place for such types of monstrosities. On another note, it was hilarious when her haters confused U18 Bra with U16 Bra and ranted their irrational hatred only to get schooled when someone pointed out their rehearsed lines being automated at this point as they didn't even bother reading anything. All they knew that a Bra was there so they rushed to post hate, violence and rape demands about Bra as soon as the page released. Not even the Bra they say they hate. Still same vulgar antics regardless and not one Bra haters called them out on it. Heck, It's frustrating how no Bra haters ever calls out other Bra haters when they get into a frenzy demanding Bra be raped. No male character ever gets such things said towards them. Just Bra and occasionally other female characters to a lesser extent. Bet you that if Bra wasn't hot they wouldn't demand her rape as it seems to me that they're just projecting the violent thoughts they wish to partake upon Bra, who is an attractive powerful woman, themselves which seriously worries me on how they view strong women in real life who aren't meek and submissive towards them. Keep making posts like this and you will not last long in this forum. While Stouty and Syrias tolerated crying-heart pseudo-white knights comments and bypassed random accusations with no proof at all in the comment sections, they (we) will not here. Although this is a forum connected to the DBM community, remember this is only a fraction of the total community: those that wish to have longer and more detailed debates. 80% of the comments section or so doesn't really wish to do so. So 'if' you saw a "Bra deserves to get murdered/raped/clowned" in the main comments page and shocked you almost to death, you have no business coming into here and trying to point fingers. Moreover, using words like "hater" unironically makes you seem really thin-skinned and immature. Like Vegeta would say, not a true Saiyan. And again, as you can see, the ones "hating" Bra in this forum are a minority. As suspected, the majority just had a neutral, if not slightly negative opinion on her, which is perfectly fine. Of course the last episode swayed the things to negativity a bit more, but that's generally what happens when you pull lots of bullshit. And now, with this special (although I find it fine, though not its placement) finally gives us a Bra overdose. So, it's natural a lot of people are quite tired of her. By the way, I am not sure if you are trolling with "strong woman", though perhaps it's worth noting that Krilin, despite being weaker, "conquered" a stronger woman than him. I had told Kaio del Norte to stop this kind of posting (and he did, because I think he understands these kind of comments are just worthless meta-banter, If I recall correctly he called Akroma a beta male for disliking Bra's attitude) around a month ago and you directly came here to add fuel to the fire. Why? Is there any specific reason? 28 persons have voted and only 4 "hate" her. Yet we have you implicitly call us atrocities and sexists?
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Post by Son Pan on Oct 4, 2016 19:13:20 GMT
Frankly, Dragonball in general was in desperate need for a character like U16 Bra. She is such a polarising enigma. I think it is hilarious coz she is basically a teenage female Vegeta that fights against genocide instead of gettin off on it, but is considered a cunt that has to change. I sincerely hope she stays the way she is. I guess to each his own. I don't get how you can compare her to Vegeta, but say she was a character we needed. Do you mean an arrogant person that never learns their lesson or become more humble to set her apart from other characters (like Tien, Piccolo, and Vegeta) or do you mean a female warrior who will stay active? I can see your line of thinking. To be honest while I do like Vegeta at the same time he got tiresome, especially with his arrogance and how he treated everyone like shit. Don't get wrong he was always entertaining to watch, but I cheered for and against him a lot. Him getting ass handed to him by 18 and Cell after several episodes of him either treating Trunks like shit or allowing Cell to get complete (yes a little upset for Krillin by that too) that his crushing defeats were satisfying to watch.
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Post by Archon on Oct 4, 2016 20:56:52 GMT
Yeah Genghis I think it's almost a type of concern trolling. It's not neccesary to bring up stuff that happens in the comment section in here unless it directly has a point mentioned for the subject but when the people posting in the comment section are the target of the post it's more of just a bait to start a fight over it. Sardorim take that stuff elsewhere please intentionally inflammatory posts aren't wanted here.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2016 21:34:15 GMT
Yeah Genghis I think it's almost a type of concern trolling. It's not neccesary to bring up stuff that happens in the comment section in here unless it directly has a point mentioned for the subject but when the people posting in the comment section are the target of the post it's more of just a bait to start a fight over it. Sardorim take that stuff elsewhere please intentionally inflammatory posts aren't wanted here. Like opiomorph said, I'm tempted to say this guy is that Yoko character from the main site, basically for all the reasons he listed; The way he types, the obvious attempt to provoke people, blatantly ignoring people who prove him wrong, etc etc. I brought him (Yoko) up to Stouty once I began to notice the pattern of troll-like actions but he basically shut me down and said "Don't call someone a troll based on their opinion." (Which, needless to say, I wasn't doing that, not sure what made mah boi StoutyDaOne believe I would do such a horrible thing! D;)
Anyway, I don't know, like I said I'm tempted to believe they're the same guy based on similarities, but I don't get why he would bother using a different name :/ Unless Sardorim means something similar to "Wrong, invaild, or illogical" like Yoko does that I'm not aware of. I don't know, anyone wanna try a Google search?
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Post by Archon on Oct 4, 2016 21:39:04 GMT
Sardorim isn't a word in the dictionary. Closest google got was Sardonic which is mocking or cynical.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2016 21:47:57 GMT
Sardorim isn't a word in the dictionary. Closest google got was Sardonic which is mocking or cynical. Well it's obviously not an English word if nothing else. I meant if there's a translation. The closest thing (or rather, only thing) I got (using Google Translate which isn't a good translator to begin with) was "Leadership" from a language called "Uzbek". Strange. Googling "Sardorim" just gives me a bunch of users from different forums as well, it's coincidentally a very popular user name apparently lol.
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Post by Archon on Oct 4, 2016 21:54:02 GMT
Sardorim isn't a word in the dictionary. Closest google got was Sardonic which is mocking or cynical. Well it's obviously not an English word if nothing else. I meant if there's a translation. The closest thing (or rather, only thing) I got (using Google Translate which isn't a good translator to begin with) was "Leadership" from a language called "Uzbek". Strange. Googling "Sardorim" just gives me a bunch of users from different forums as well, it's coincidentally a very popular user name apparently lol.oh didn't know you meant translation XD
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Post by The Masterman on Oct 4, 2016 22:19:06 GMT
I like her, she comes off as a saiyan female.
I don't see why people hate her, she stated her thoughts on several battles, she lost control a few times but so far has remained a valuable character to DBM.
I will say the senzu were a bit out of place because it means she's a tactical genus who knew Cold had a trick or two which hasn't been shown to be 100% true minus her remarks on several battles though she was kinda playing Captain Obvious at that point.
Also I'm guessing here but my thought on how she got the first senzu in her mouth:
It fell out as she reappeared and all she could do to quickly get to it was do a face-plant on it.
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Post by animeality on Oct 5, 2016 15:56:58 GMT
I hope you aren't suggesting that Bra should have lost to Cold. That would just be silly and poor story telling as well as just a failed attempt to try and appease a hateful part of the fan base that would still hate Bra regardless. I am. Hear this! The thing with the Cold fight is that A) it's a unioque scenario where a character has restricted themselves to their base form, and B) the enemy has two transformations right off the bat that leave the opponent at a disadvantage. Bra put herself in this scenario, and we all expected her to win. She's fought both previous rounds without transforming. At this point Bra is reviled - not saying I hate her, but let's be honest, a lot of others do - so an "author's saving throw" might have been to have her actually lose. She's arrogant, she's haughty, and there's a trope out there called Break The Haughty which is basically a sumamtion of everything Vegeta went through in Dragonball. I think the reason we/some of us like Vegeta is because he goes through so much hardship. He can talk big and act like a jerk but he gets wrecked frequently, so it's easy to sympathize with him. So getting to the point - I expected Bra to lose this because he had a panel of her pummeled and bloodied after escaping Cold's assault. Because the scenario I imagine would be her still using the Senzu Bean trick and narrowly escaping Cold's Destructo Disks, but then forfeiting the fight - because she knows she had to cheat in order to beat Cold and couldn't do it with just her base form. This establishes some humility, and honor, and while we knew from the beginning Bra could take Cold apart if she'd transformed, she made a bet that she couldn't follow through on. I don't really know a fancy way to say it, but I say this "brings her down a notch." That's what I want from this character - she's cantankerous, narcissistic, and a braggart; that all goes away when you have her lose a fight she was perfectly capable of winning and she realizes that and accepts that arrogance cost her the match. I don't know about you, but I don't consider that poor writing. It's not appeasing a hateful part of the fanbase... well at least that's not the point. It's making a character who is mostly unhindered and unflappable come down to earth. If the point of Bra's character is that she is a moody teenager whose grown up with an invincible dad and is herself probably the 2nd strongest person on the planet then, like Vegeta, the primary goal of her character development would be to tear down her conceptions of being the strongest there is and let her grow from there. As it is, Bra basically won the fight and will continue to be the same person she was before the fight started. I loath saying it, but having Bra win and learn nothing from this battle, to me, is poor writing because it doesn't evolve Bra's character, and makes the fight pointless - she did exactly what she said she would and beat Cold in her base form, so what was the point of the fight besides those delicious cheesecake shots of Bra's ass? I mean I like T&A I'm not complaining but come on they could've used the post-round night scenes for that.
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Post by Ashanark on Oct 5, 2016 17:46:32 GMT
So getting to the point - I expected Bra to lose this because he had a panel of her pummeled and bloodied after escaping Cold's assault. Because the scenario I imagine would be her still using the Senzu Bean trick and narrowly escaping Cold's Destructo Disks, but then forfeiting the fight - because she knows she had to cheat in order to beat Cold and couldn't do it with just her base form. This establishes some humility, and honor, and while we knew from the beginning Bra could take Cold apart if she'd transformed, she made a bet that she couldn't follow through on. I don't really know a fancy way to say it, but I say this "brings her down a notch." That's what I want from this character - she's cantankerous, narcissistic, and a braggart; that all goes away when you have her lose a fight she was perfectly capable of winning and she realizes that and accepts that arrogance cost her the match. I don't know about you, but I don't consider that poor writing. It's not appeasing a hateful part of the fanbase... well at least that's not the point. It's making a character who is mostly unhindered and unflappable come down to earth. If the point of Bra's character is that she is a moody teenager whose grown up with an invincible dad and is herself probably the 2nd strongest person on the planet then, like Vegeta, the primary goal of her character development would be to tear down her conceptions of being the strongest there is and let her grow from there. As it is, Bra basically won the fight and will continue to be the same person she was before the fight started. I loath saying it, but having Bra win and learn nothing from this battle, to me, is poor writing because it doesn't evolve Bra's character, and makes the fight pointless. Writing the Bra vs. Cold fight was a no-win situation. No matter what Salagir did, there were going to be complaints: --If Bra goes Super Saiyan and stomps Cold, then fans will complain it's a boring fight, just like Goku vs. Mahissi or 17. --If Bra doesn't go Super Saiyan and gets stomped by Cold, then fans will complain they get a boring fight next round. (Sorry, all you Frost Demon fans out there: I don't see any way Cold could stand a chance against Gast or Raichi without serious baloney going down.) --If Bra stays in base but can fight evenly with Cold and beat him without shenanigans, then fans will complain Cold's sixth form is pointless and Bra is overpowered. --If Cold is stronger than Bra and she can only win through tricks (senzu bean, gravity goo), then fans will complain Bra is a cheater and Cold deserved the win. Salagir went with Option 4, which I'd say was the best option overall. I agree there were writing problems: the beans in the glove were not foreshadowed that well, and Bra's secret moves weren't foreshadowed at all. But still, this way Cold's sixth form was still relevant, the fight still had tension, everyone was still in-character, and we get an actual fight next round. (Also, technically the fight isn't over yet. It'd be really hilarious if Cold is Ginyu and he pulls off a swap on Bra, trapping her in the body she just chopped in half.) I disagree that Bra vs. Cold should've been when Bra was humbled. I don't like comparing Bra to Vegeta, but let's look at every major moment of humbling Vegeta's faced (there are four): 1. Vegeta's life goal for a long time was to kill Frieza. Yet, when he gets the stuffing beat out of him by Frieza, he accepts that Goku is the Super Saiyan, not him, and that Goku will be the one to defeat Frieza, not him. 2. When Cell kills Trunks, Vegeta realizes that he did actually care for Trunks, and goes berserk. 3. Majin Vegeta realizes that his pride has caused everything to get bungled--Majin Buu is released, Gohan is dead--and prevented him from having a real relationship with his son. So, he decides to set things right. 4. When Vegeta has to give up against Kid Buu and let Goku fight, Vegeta realizes that he doesn't have to be better than Goku. It's okay for him to be second-best. Each one of these moments challenged or changed something fundamental about Vegeta. He didn't necessarily become a good person, but he learned something. Losing to Cold wouldn't have forced Bra to confront anything about herself. What matters most to her is strength and winning, and she'd know that she could've killed Cold with her aura alone if she went to max, so her core beliefs would not be shaken up at all. I hope that Gast or Raichi will be able to put Bra down a notch, but honestly I predict Bra will only be humbled when Vegito goes crazy sometime in the future. That'll force her to acknowledge that strength isn't everything.
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Post by sardorim on Oct 5, 2016 20:31:00 GMT
Not to mention the amount of physical violence and hate she gets thrown towards her by her haters until the mods have to do theur daily page cleaning. I'm still shocked that those demanding Bra be raped aren't instantly ip banned on the main dbm website as the same ones keel coming back repeating the same thing every page that features Bra. The community has no place for such types of monstrosities. On another note, it was hilarious when her haters confused U18 Bra with U16 Bra and ranted their irrational hatred only to get schooled when someone pointed out their rehearsed lines being automated at this point as they didn't even bother reading anything. All they knew that a Bra was there so they rushed to post hate, violence and rape demands about Bra as soon as the page released. Not even the Bra they say they hate. Still same vulgar antics regardless and not one Bra haters called them out on it. Heck, It's frustrating how no Bra haters ever calls out other Bra haters when they get into a frenzy demanding Bra be raped. No male character ever gets such things said towards them. Just Bra and occasionally other female characters to a lesser extent. Bet you that if Bra wasn't hot they wouldn't demand her rape as it seems to me that they're just projecting the violent thoughts they wish to partake upon Bra, who is an attractive powerful woman, themselves which seriously worries me on how they view strong women in real life who aren't meek and submissive towards them. Who's been saying they want to see Bra raped? Not that I really care too much, cause creepers gonna creep, and some folks just say stuff like "Oh, you been raped" or make a TFS quote. But I really haven't seen the Bra rape pandemic in either forums. Do you have screen caps or links to pages? You must not follow DBM comment section that often as Bra at least gets a couple every time she fights or says something that isn't a stereotypical submissive waifu statement. The mods have gotten better at deleting those comments and banning those users but those users always find ways back. - Cold being Ginyu and pulling a swap in front of the entire audience would be poor writing and make Ginyu look incompetent than the serious threat he's being built up as. Not to mention that he wouldn't know how to act as Bra and that Bra isn't even the strongest. We also see the future vision of Bra and she isn't taken by Ginyu, she's still a daddy's girl she always has and looking down on those who dare to compare themselves to her father.
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Post by opiomorph on Oct 5, 2016 20:51:20 GMT
So getting to the point - I expected Bra to lose this because he had a panel of her pummeled and bloodied after escaping Cold's assault. Because the scenario I imagine would be her still using the Senzu Bean trick and narrowly escaping Cold's Destructo Disks, but then forfeiting the fight - because she knows she had to cheat in order to beat Cold and couldn't do it with just her base form. This establishes some humility, and honor, and while we knew from the beginning Bra could take Cold apart if she'd transformed, she made a bet that she couldn't follow through on. I don't really know a fancy way to say it, but I say this "brings her down a notch." That's what I want from this character - she's cantankerous, narcissistic, and a braggart; that all goes away when you have her lose a fight she was perfectly capable of winning and she realizes that and accepts that arrogance cost her the match. I don't know about you, but I don't consider that poor writing. It's not appeasing a hateful part of the fanbase... well at least that's not the point. It's making a character who is mostly unhindered and unflappable come down to earth. If the point of Bra's character is that she is a moody teenager whose grown up with an invincible dad and is herself probably the 2nd strongest person on the planet then, like Vegeta, the primary goal of her character development would be to tear down her conceptions of being the strongest there is and let her grow from there. As it is, Bra basically won the fight and will continue to be the same person she was before the fight started. I loath saying it, but having Bra win and learn nothing from this battle, to me, is poor writing because it doesn't evolve Bra's character, and makes the fight pointless. Writing the Bra vs. Cold fight was a no-win situation. No matter what Salagir did, there were going to be complaints: --If Bra goes Super Saiyan and stomps Cold, then fans will complain it's a boring fight, just like Goku vs. Mahissi or 17. --If Bra doesn't go Super Saiyan and gets stomped by Cold, then fans will complain they get a boring fight next round. (Sorry, all you Frost Demon fans out there: I don't see any way Cold could stand a chance against Gast or Raichi without serious baloney going down.) --If Bra stays in base but is able to fight evenly with Cold and beat him without shenanigans, then fans will complain Cold's sixth form is pointless and Bra is overpowered. --If Cold is stronger than Bra and she can only win through tricks (senzu bean, gravity goo), then fans will complain Bra is a cheater and Cold deserved the win. Salagir went with Option 4, which I'd say was the best option overall. I agree there were writing problems: the beans in the glove were not foreshadowed that well, and Bra's secret moves weren't foreshadowed at all. But still, this way Cold's sixth form was still relevant, the fight still had tension, everyone was still in-character, and we get an actual fight next round. (Also, technically the fight isn't over yet. It'd be really hilarious if Cold is Ginyu and he pulls off a swap on Bra, trapping her in the body she just chopped in half.) I disagree that Bra vs. Cold should've been when Bra was humbled. I don't like comparing Bra to Vegeta, but let's look at every major moment of humbling Vegeta's faced (there are four): 1. Vegeta's life goal for a long time was to kill Frieza. Yet, when he gets the stuffing beat out of him by Frieza, he accepts that Goku is the Super Saiyan, not him, and that Goku will be the one to defeat Frieza, not him. 2. When Cell kills Trunks, Vegeta realizes that he did actually care for Trunks, and goes berserk. 3. Majin Vegeta realizes that his pride has caused everything to get bungled--Majin Buu is released, Gohan is dead--and preventing him from having a real relationship with his son. So, he decides to set things right. 4. When Vegeta has to give up against Kid Buu and let Goku fight, Vegeta realizes that he doesn't have to be better than Goku. It's okay for him to be second-best. Each one of these moments challenged or changed something fundamental about Vegeta. He didn't necessarily become a good person, but he learned something. Losing to Cold wouldn't have forced Bra to confront anything about herself. What matters most to her is strength and winning, and she'd know that she could've killed Cold with her aura alone if she went to max, so her core beliefs would not be shaken up at all. I hope that Gast or Raichi will be able to put Bra down a notch, but honestly I predict Bra will only be humbled when Vegito goes crazy sometime in the future. That'll force her to acknowledge that strength isn't everything. I'm gonna have to disagree. It was a perfect chance to do something with Bra's character. Either take that chance and go with option E: Kold beats her down after a long, satisfying fight, or don't - and go with "A" and play it for laughs.In my humble opinion, as evidenced by the borderline hilarious scale and intensity of the outrage, "D" was, in the long run - the worst possible option to be taken, it didn't just piss off a single fraction of the fanbase, it managed to piss almost all of them off to varying degrees - it will leave a lasting stink. I've already seen it compared to the Bojack special and Future Gohan vs. Dabura, plenty of times. Whatever backlash a quick round of Koldstomping here or in the quarter-finals would cause, would be puny by comparison and would wash out the moment the next fight starts. So, I guess I agree with Animeality - that the entire chapter was a huge waste of time, build-up and opportunity. I also agree with you, that contrary to what the majority expects - Gast won't be able to influence Bra in any meaningful way. Bra respects strenght and... that's about all she respects - that's her biggest problem. She's horribly callous and if we take the novel into account, flat out mean-spirited for no reason at all, towards those who she deems as inferior - who coincidentally happen to be everyone outside her immediate family Gast won't be able to shake that mindset, because when he beats her, it'll just play into her existing mindset, that power = all. She'll just decide that she had an awesome fight an that she needs to train some more. That's why I disagree with you when you say that losing to someone like Kold wouldn't influence her. In my opinion, losing to someone who she considered trash not even worth her time, simply because she let him play her and her insecurities, and thought herself invincible against an "insect" - is about the only thing that can rattle her some.Sure, she would probably bitch and moan, that " He cheated! BAWWWW!", But that's the spot where Son "World's No.1 Dad" Gohan enters the stage and bluntly tells her the unvarnished truth " Cheated or not, while you're busy drowning in the pool of your own blood, he's busy destroying everything you love and hold dear...and it's all your fault." She'd probably bitch some more, but in the end would be forced to take a long hard look in the mirror and perhaps try to change, which would make for a nice character arc, as she struggles with what she now perceives as flaws. And perhaps it would be the first step towards realising that all those pesky subhuman insects that dare breath the same air as her, aren't really beneath her after all.We're already past the half-way point of the story, considering that nothing was done with the character up to his point(all exposition, but no development) and that by the time she, once gain takes the centre stage, we're probably gonna be at around 70% mark, whatever shift she'll potentially experience will either be laughably " snap-of-finger" sudden(because there won't be any time left for an interesting 'journey'), or won't happen at all. Salagir probably has some sort of plan, but I have no idea what it is.
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